Raheem Morris discussion thread

[Billy Baroo]

His defensive style is simply not beneficial to how McVay wants to play the game.

He was hand-picked by McVay though??

 

[PARAM]

He was hand-picked by McVay though??

Yeah. But his style is simply not beneficial to how McVay wants to play the game? Then why did McVay pick him? Here's one thought. McVay figured since he finally had the QB who could execute his offense, the only thing he needed from the defense was "make them go the long way and they will have to settle for FGs or turn the ball over. Meanwhile, my offense, finally with the arm I always wanted will throw darts all over the field and down the field".

It WILL work....if we score TDs and don't turn the ball over much. And the numbers bare that out.

There have been 45 drives against the Rams defense than have been either double digit play possessions OR 75 yards+ in distance OR have consumed 4 and a half minutes plus in time. Opponents have scored 23 TDs, kicked 13 field goals and turned the ball over 9 times, either on picks, fumbles or downs. On other drives not of those parameters (136), they have scored 12 TDs, kicked 17 field goals or turned the ball over either on interceptions (15), fumbles (5), downs (9) and missed FGs (4), 33 times in total.

So that's the way McVay wants to play it. It's just that his offense hasn't quite worked as well as he thought going into the season.

 

[Merlin]

Really? Wow, a little pissy aren't we? Facts sometimes have a way of doing that.

Riddle me this Wizard. How many "long" TD drives did Staley's defense allow last year? And by long, let's say either double digit plays or 75 yards or 4:30 in elapsed time and sometimes all of the above. How many has Morris' D allowed? I did the fucking research. But you tell me, who had more? If you don't know, then do the research yourself before shooting off your mouth with the "meandering nonsense". Pretty phrase though, eh?

Our offense sucked last year. And Staley's D was #1. So now you think Staley is something. 1 year as a DC. Perhaps the comparison to Wade inflated that "something" just a bit?

Our offense is scoring 27.1 PPG this year. In losses, they have scored 19.6 PPG....and that is with the benefit of a garbage time TD vs Arizona, a garbage time TD vs Tennessee and a couple of garbage time FGs vs SF and Green Bay. Take those scores out and during the competitive parts of those games, we averaged 15.6 PPG. Impressive, eh? Truth is we lost 5 games and 1 can be attributed to Morris' defense...the last one and that's only because they were falling like stones in the secondary. Those other 4 losses can be put squarely on the shoulders of our offense...and in some cases, directly on the shoulders of our QB, with his pick 6's and arm punts! Those are what need fixing!!!!

So our defense in need of fixing has cost us 1 game, while our vaunted offense has cost us 4. Yeah, I'd blame Morris too!!!

No I just am annoyed by this desire to minimize what Staley pulled off last season. He had a great season as DC. Morris is having a so-so season.

And btw I am not hating on Morris here. Outside of a couple folks there isn't a whole lot of that going on. In fact if we end up with him in a year 2 I expect he'll be better. Why? Because I know he's learning.

We have a few posters hating on Morris. Then we have a few posters defending any perceived slight of Morris. As usual both ends of the extreme are nonsense. Truth is in the middle as always IMO.

He was hand-picked by McVay though??

He sure was. And I said it looked like a friend hire when the hire happened. Hopefully it'll be a friend hire that works out, we'll see here soon.

 

[PARAM]

No I just am annoyed by this desire to minimize what Staley pulled off last season. He had a great season as DC. Morris is having a so-so season.

We were #1 in defense. Of course he had a great season as DC. Morris is having a lesser season with lesser talent. I just get annoyed when that is totally ignored. And the differences aren't that great. Less than 3 PPG (when you take out the pick 6's). Considering Stafford has turned the ball over more than Goff, that plays into it too....without counting the pick 6's. I liked Staley and thought he did a fine job with guys who were here for years. Is he great? I don't know. I only saw him 1 year. And this year his team is #31 in the NFL. Certainly not trying to minimize his efforts. But I ain't saying he's Buddy Ryan either.

 

[1maGoh]

Thanks for the conversation.

On the first point, I'll just say I don't think it's plausible that Morris isn't running the defense McVay wants. McVay brought him in and there's a lot of reporting on what was the intent there.. to keep the core concepts, but to build on it.
I don't think it's plausible because of a couple of main things.. their relationship is too deep and too longterm for Morris to pull something like that. He wasn't going to be out of work this year, he's a respected coach. Also, based on what we know about McVay, he says his best coaching relationships are with guys who honestly challenge him, he talks a lot about really getting into it with LaFluer when he was on staff. I don't believe for one second that McVay wouldn't say, clearly, what he wanted to see on that side of the ball.
So, it's possible that he's not running what McVay wants, but I don't think it's plausible.

I get your point about corners, but, based on snap count, Troy Hill was the #2 Corner on the Rams last year. What's more, he was their most versatile corner outside of Ramsey. He played the star role a bunch, which isn't something that I think Williams can do. Late in the season, if you remember, Hill started a couple of games at outside corner ahead of Williams.
I'm happy to argue that the difference between Hill and Long/DD has been that big in several ways.. including the fact that he played the star very well, which helped keep Jalen outside. The dropoff from JJ to Rapp in coverage is very large.

I understand what you and everyone say about Rapp playing close to the line, and Morris has tried to make that happen more as the season goes on. The problem is you can't *only* have Rapp play close to the line. Neither he nor Scott are really any good deep and they don't have anyone else. The dropoff in that specific aspect from JJ has been massive. My hope and expectation going into this season was that Burgess was going to develop into the guy who would be able to play in coverage or the high shell. Nope. Or, maybe Morris is fucking up and he can play, but they're just not playing him. I doubt that, but, hey.. anything is possible.

There is literally no reason to fire Morris mid-season and even thinking that seems outrageous to me. The Rams are top 5 in defensive points allowed. To think that there is some kind of problem that demands change is wild.

I am going to get back to the end of the 9ers game.

The Rams D had given up a FG drive in a short time at the end of the first half. They'd been gashed pretty good in the second and had just lost one of their two best DBs and the guy who calls the signals for the defense.
McVay decided not to try very hard to get a first down and end the game.

I'm still having a hard time processing that decision.

The idea isn't that Morris is being straight up defiant. I just think that because of his background when he draws up a new play or is crunch time and he's calling a game, he reverts back to his comfort zone. I also find it incongruous that you say McVay wants people that will challenge him and that Morris is doing exactly what McVay wants. Is he challenging McVay's preferences and assumptions or is he doing exactly what McVay tells him to do with the defense

I don't think snap counts dictate who your number 2 CB is. Lots of things can affect snap counts. I vaguely remember Hill over Williams late, but not enough to argue about anything in particular (injury or whatever else may be). The reality is, for most of the year Hill was 3rd behind Ramsey and Williams. You can try to spin master whatever you want, but that's what it was. We all knew it then, we all know it now.

I don't think Morris deserved to be fired mid-season. I wasn't happy with him and it would have been nice to have an instant upgrade, but that's not possible. My point was even if he was so bad, McVay can't fire the guy mid-season. I didn't think Morris would actually change and get better, so I expected him to be fired (promoted away from calling defense, whatever it looked like) after the season, but he did and here we are. His tendencies occasionally bites us in the butt. His MAD play stuff occasionally bites us in the butt (Ramsey jumping a route to try for an interception...). But for the most part he's doing much much better recently. I think we can ride him into next year and expect marginal improvement assuming they plug some roster holes. I'm not sure they can given the cap, but maybe.

We'll see.

 

[dieterbrock]

Had the offense done it's job that 88 yard drive would have been garbage time against a prevent defense. The Rams didn't play it perfect they shit the bed as a total team in the 2nd half. This obsession with piling on Morris with all the blame for the loss just is baffling after watching the entire team be horrible in the 2nd half.

We scored 24 points, that's middle of the pack in the NFL which is unacceptable as a team with as much talent as we do with our coach and QB and that was in 5 quarters.

The offense did its job, gave the team a 7 point lead at home with 2:29 to go in the game. And they did what they were supposed to do after they got the ball back, not turn it over, make San Fran burn all their time outs, and pin them deep. Its football 101
As for the 24 points, what kind of logic is that? So if the Rams were leading 31-24, and San Fran drove the field to tie the game, THEN it would be a problem?
The D blew it, plain and simple.

 

[OldSchool]

The offense did its job, gave the team a 7 point lead at home with 2:29 to go in the game. And they did what they were supposed to do after they got the ball back, not turn it over, make San Fran burn all their time outs, and pin them deep. Its football 101
As for the 24 points, what kind of logic is that? So if the Rams were leading 31-24, and San Fran drove the field to tie the game, THEN it would be a problem?
The D blew it, plain and simple.

The O did it's job in the first half and shit the bed in the 2nd half. Seven lousy points to try to close out a game? No denying the D got worked in the 2nd half after just like the O playing great in the 1st half. You have a chance to put your opponent out of it's misery and couldn't do a damned thing for 30 minutes of a game? They scored with 1:30 left in the first half and didn't sniff points again until they scored with 5:13 left in the game. That's 26:07 of absolute shit from the offense.

6 plays 13 yards punt
3 plays 4 yards punt
3 plays -6 yards INT
9 plays 92 yards TD
6 plays 14 yards punt
3 plays 5 yards punt
2 plays 9 yards end of the 4th quarter
5 plays 20 yards INT end of game

In what world is getting 151 yards with 92 in one drive in the last 41 minutes of a game you're trying to win to secure the #2 seed in the playoffs the offense doing it's job? They shit the bed for more of the game than they did well! I'm not saying the D was good all game they were bad for just as long. But there is no reality where laying down with a 14 point lead is going to win you games in the NFL. The offense led by McVay and Stafford need to improve just as much as the Morris, Ramsey and Donald led defense does. A 265 yard performance in today's NFL is unacceptable especially at home. Btw that's even worse than the first time we lost to them this year and both times we played them are our only sub 300 yard games on offense. Quit making excuses for them. The fact the Niners were even in the game when you're applauding the offense for getting a 7 point lead is a result as much of the offense as the defense having a bad 2nd half. McVay can't seem to put away a dangerous opponent, no wonder Shanny has beat him 6 times in a row.

 

[sloramfan]

please anybody..

post 3 and outs this year vs 3 and outs last year...

go rams

slo

 

[dieterbrock]

The O did it's job in the first half and shit the bed in the 2nd half.

That's fine, but still they did their job.
I dont care if its a 7-0 lead or 37-30, they scored the go ahead td with 2+ minutes to go after the team blew a 17-0 lead.
The D has to keep them out of the end zone, period. San Fran killed them with the run in 2nd half and leading up to that disasterous 59 seconds, Garoppolo was around 180 yards, 0 td and 2 int. If you cant stop Jimmy G from going 88 yards and no TD, you dont deserve to win.
I'd be more than happy to discuss my thoughts on how I thought the offense was awful in the 2nd half, but that would be a different topic from the current one. Which is that the D blew it

 

[Ellard80]

That's fine, but still they did their job.
I dont care if its a 7-0 lead or 37-30, they scored the go ahead td with 2+ minutes to go after the team blew a 17-0 lead.
The D has to keep them out of the end zone, period. San Fran killed them with the run in 2nd half and leading up to that disasterous 59 seconds, Garoppolo was around 180 yards, 0 td and 2 int. If you cant stop Jimmy G from going 88 yards and no TD, you dont deserve to win.
I'd be more than happy to discuss my thoughts on how I thought the offense was awful in the 2nd half, but that would be a different topic from the current one. Which is that the D blew it

the 49ners got the ball back with 1:58 left i believe... so even worst then the time you posted earlier.

Edit: even worse than i remember - 49ners got the ball back with 1:27 left and no timeouts and 90 yards to go.

Its funny how many people are just glossing over that horrible display to shit on mcvay for not going for the 1st down.

Good thing is i think mcvay will be more aggressive in that situation.

However the obsessing over that decision is just fucking strange to me... thats not what lost the game.

 

[OldSchool]

That's fine, but still they did their job.
I dont care if its a 7-0 lead or 37-30, they scored the go ahead td with 2+ minutes to go after the team blew a 17-0 lead.
The D has to keep them out of the end zone, period. San Fran killed them with the run in 2nd half and leading up to that disasterous 59 seconds, Garoppolo was around 180 yards, 0 td and 2 int. If you cant stop Jimmy G from going 88 yards and no TD, you dont deserve to win.
I'd be more than happy to discuss my thoughts on how I thought the offense was awful in the 2nd half, but that would be a different topic from the current one. Which is that the D blew it

hahaha you got it. Shit the bed for the vast majority of the game and they did their job If you have 8 drives to finish the game and put 7 points on the board and turn the ball over twice that's as far as you can get from doing your job. Sorry it's not a different topic both sides of the ball failed to win the game. This thought that 7 points in the last 40+ minutes of the game is enough to win is well if it was anybody other than you I'd use words that the mods don't like but you're my guy and I won't use those words. Even McVay says they didn't do enough to win the game. They made some plays but it wasn't enough.

 

[Ellard80]

hahaha you got it. Shit the bed for the vast majority of the game and they did their job If you have 8 drives to finish the game and put 7 points on the board and turn the ball over twice that's as far as you can get from doing your job. Sorry it's not a different topic both sides of the ball failed to win the game. This thought that 7 points in the last 40+ minutes of the game is enough to win is well if it was anybody other than you I'd use words that the mods don't like but you're my guy and I won't use those words. Even McVay says they didn't do enough to win the game. They made some plays but it wasn't enough.

the offense was not good the 2nd half at all.

but when the other team gets the ball back with 1:27 an no time outs and 90 yards to go.

The game should be over.

 

[Ellard80]

here it is... 49ners had a less than 1% chance of winning after they punted at the end.

0.4 % chance when they punted it away.

49ers had less than 1 percent chance of beating Rams after late punt

The #49ers punted late and had less than a 1% chance of beating the Rams. But there was always a chance.

ninerswire.usatoday.com

 

[OldSchool]

the offense was not good the 2nd half at all.

but when the other team gets the ball back with 1:27 an no time outs and 90 yards to go.

The game should be over.

And when the offense gets the ball back down by 3 with more time than that and a chance to win the game they should be able to do that. But they didn't they shit the bed yet again. Defense held them to a field goal and prevented a walk off win and how did the offense respond? 2nd down interception they couldn't win the game. Neither side deserves any credit when you get right down to it

 

[OldSchool]

here it is... 49ners had a less than 1% chance of winning after they punted at the end.

0.4 % chance when they punted it away.

49ers had less than 1 percent chance of beating Rams after late punt

The #49ers punted late and had less than a 1% chance of beating the Rams. But there was always a chance.

ninerswire.usatoday.com

Looks like the Rams had about a 40% chance to win there in OT when they got the ball back. Shame the offense couldn't do it.

 

[OldSchool]

Good thing is i think mcvay will be more aggressive in that situation.

OK now that's funny, he was so aggressive trying to win the game he gave three half assed run plays up the middle and punted.

 

[FarNorth]

the 49ners got the ball back with 1:58 left i believe... so even worst then the time you posted earlier.

Edit: even worse than i remember - 49ners got the ball back with 1:27 left and no timeouts and 90 yards to go.

Its funny how many people are just glossing over that horrible display to shit on mcvay for not going for the 1st down.

Good thing is i think mcvay will be more aggressive in that situation.

However the obsessing over that decision is just fucking strange to me... thats not what lost the game.

Sorry, but with all due respect imo that is what lost the game. McVay had a golden opportunity to close the Niners out to where they had ZERO chance to win. He failed to see the strategic importance of not giving them the ball back. He dialed up a robocall run on third and seven. The defense should have held but didn't.

Imo Rams can't win with key play calls which fail to implement the right strategy to win the game. Not just bad calls-- calls which are inconsistent with a game winning strategy. McVay did the same thing, different flavor, in the first half.

It's not just bad play calling. It's a strategic weakness that needs to stop.

 

[So Ram]

Yes it was the defenses fault.
I'm sure McVay knew Fuller was out. I wonder if McVay knew Rapp was injured and DWill was hurting? Had he known all that, maybe he plays it differently. I know making SF call the 3 timeouts was the key. When they did it I was glad even though they didn't get the first down. But I also didn't know the defense was that short on personnel.

There is still no excuse that the defense didn’t come through.If that cost The Rams a playoff then that is something else.Tampa Bay benefits from it.the 9ers got super lucky to be playing still.If The Rams loss to 8ers a 3rd time I will look back.For now it is just spelt milk.
Like after any win or loss it is on to the next game.The season is still alive.The Rams have the talent.
—I could go on & on about the defense.I like The Rams future as well.The Rams have the pieces if healthy.

 

[So Ram]

OK now that's funny, he was so aggressive trying to win the game he gave three half assed run plays up the middle

The 3rd & 1 in the 2qrt. ? Will he pass it again ? I saw the play again.
How does he go empty?

 

[PARAM]

There is still no excuse that the defense didn’t come through.If that cost The Rams a playoff then that is something else.Tampa Bay benefits from it.the 9ers got super lucky to be playing still.If The Rams loss to 8ers a 3rd time I will look back.For now it is just spelt milk.
Like after any win or loss it is on to the next game.The season is still alive.The Rams have the talent.
—I could go on & on about the defense.I like The Rams future as well.The Rams have the pieces if healthy.

It's an excuse but I don't excuse them. They are still pros. And I agreed at the time with the 3 yards and a cloud of dust offensive approach to burn SFs timeouts. But hindsight is always 20/20. I remember watching the Ravens go for 2 against the Steelers "because their secondary had been decimated" late in the game. They failed. But that doesn't mean it was the wrong decision. Just like the Rams playing small ball there to give the niners the ball with under 2 minutes and no timeouts. Because the defense failed it doesn't mean it was the wrong decision. They had forced a three and out on the previous possession. Fuller was out during that possession too so there was no reason to expect a different outcome. Like somebody else stated....I don't remember if was here or elsewhere...."it's over, we're still playing at home and I rather suffer a speed bump in the regular season finale than in the playoffs". Of course Fuller is still out, Rapp is in concussion protocol, Williams shoulder is still an issue and we have a 37 year old safety who hasn't stepped on the field since 2019. All that means to me is....going into this game it's all about our offense. They have to play one of their best games of the year, to date, so we can see if we get healthier for the divisional round.