2023 Defense through 12 Games vs 2022 first 12 games

[Tano]

My take is blame lies with both. Would have been nice for the offense to get one first dowh. Also would have been nice
for the defense to get a stop.

What if it's a 50-50 thing and not an 80-20 either way? I don't know the answer but the unknown is if playing tight and blitzing would have helped or hurt? Or if McVay and the offense were so inept that asking them to get one first down was too much to ask.

I just wonder why it cannot be a failure - failures that happen in the NFL when you face the goat -- that does not just simply assume Morris is incompetent. Or scared or stupid.

It is one thing to think a coach runs a defense you don't like. It's another to think we know better, especially when some of the attackers on the man are simply inaccurate. Small case in point--not know what the NT does in this scheme. If you don't know that, which is right in front of our faces, then how can you know the coverages that are harder to understand by leaps and bounds and are only available on All-22? Even with that as a tool, it's still hard.

What if Morris is competent and the extreme critics are not?

I am leaning towards that.

My sole problem with the Tampa Game was that we were playing fairly tight coverages in the first 3 quarters and took the short passes away that Brady loves. We had him completely flummoxed the first 3 quarters and Brady could hardly do anything.

But once we got into the 4th quarter with a lead, Morris changed the defense to a safe defense that Brady tore apart going down field. Brady took Tampa down the field 3 times in that quarter. We got lucky on the second drive to keep them from scoring. And then on the last drive, we did not cover the out of bounds at all and Brady drove down the field with less than 50 seconds and no time outs to score a TD.

Morris knows how to design defenses but he sometimes got too cautious. I blame the assistants last year for his overly cautious approach to the games last year especially against New Orleans and the second Arizona game. We should have won both of those games and the Tampa game last year.

 

[Faceplant]

I think we all know who the "Group 4" people are..... And I am not convinced you will get a response from them on this topic, but good luck.

 

[LARAMSinFeb.]

I’m adding that to your valid concerns… and them coming off a bye week.

Isn't that every week for us?

 

[PARAM]

I blame the assistants last year for his overly cautious approach to the games last year especially against New Orleans and the second Arizona game. We should have won both of those games and the Tampa game last year.

Why blame his assistants? The blame belongs on McVay who is certainly responsible for how the defense should play. "Be aggressive" or "play soft". He's the head coach. If the Rams are playing aggressive D or soft D, it's what he wants.

 

[bubbaramfan]

I'm in group 5, the "Fuck this thread" group.

 

[JimY53]

I blame the assistants last year for his overly cautious approach to the games last year especially against New Orleans and the second Arizona game. We should have won both of those games and the Tampa game last year.

No matter who you blame for those losses, DC or Def assistants---The real concern was that the offense scored 13 points vs Tampa and gained 206 total yards. You cannot win in the NFL scoring 13 points and not being able to get one first down.

In the second Cardinals game offense managed 256 yards and 17 points (really 10 because Rams scored TD with 7 seconds left). The Saints game offense did better... 336 yards and 20 points (3 in last few seconds) but the offense did not play well enough in any of those games
to win in the NFL.

But again, this is getting away from the OP. People can rehash that game all they want ... makes little difference., anyway. The point is overall, the defense was slightly better last year, even with the Tampa game, than this year. But, people can call it a tie if they want/ Doesn't matter.

It still does not explain why people would go so far as to say Morris was incompetent then. Not just a bad game or two or whatever, but stupid, and cowardly even.

Not enough has changed for him to be competent this year, incompetent last year, competent in playoffs and incompetent in reg season of 2021.

If you want to get into the weeds of what actually happened, the good and the bad of the 2022 Tampa game, I can, but that is a separate discussion. The all-22 tells one story, sometimes people's memories don't jive with what is actually on film for 4 quarters of football. No one can analyze any game on one TV view. Games have to be seen at least 2-3 times to actually know what went on. Sure, people can see this mistake or that mistake or this good play and that good play from replays...but to know what percentage of cov-2/4 (usually off), cov-6/8 (one tight one off CB) it takes a little time.

 

[JimY53]

Why blame his assistants? The blame belongs on McVay who is certainly responsible for how the defense should play. "Be aggressive" or "play soft". He's the head coach. If the Rams are playing aggressive D or soft D, it's what he wants.

McVay is part of the game plan--and that is decided during the week, but he outsources the defense to Morris/Staley/Phillips. Most offensive coaches do that. But you raise a good item.

Folks think press = aggressive and "Soft" = not aggressive. (no saying you are doing that) it's just something you see people make an equivalency to which is not always the case. I know you're using quotes to show you know what's being said.

Off coverage, from top down, out of phase can be aggressive, that is how Jalen Ramsey prefers to play. Press can be not aggressive.

It's kind of funny how folks don't get how much autonomy that players have within a call. Ramsey's depth within a press, cloud or off call is within his discretion. Same with day, Aaron Donald. He can freelance away from gap-½ if he sees something. Ramsey, as long as he matches the route he's supposed to does it his way. The DC or secondary coach doesn't dictate things like authoritarian rulers.

Anyway, that's an aside.

Players play coverages that can play. Asking someone to play press who cannot do it well at that stage of their career just to "mix it up" or to "be aggressive" is more of a fan's view than anything.

 

[JimY53]

I think we all know who the "Group 4" people are..... And I am not convinced you will get a response from them on this topic, but good luck.

Well, maybe not. there is also a good opportunity to start from the beginning ... as to how the NT plays in this scheme. It's crickets, there. What is great is anyone can post their own clips or photos if they want to bring the receipts. So far, no response.

Maybe we can all learn.

 

[JimY53]

I wonder if folks think this has a pretty big effect on a team? Offense much better
this year than last.

Certainly, a more detailed group of stats can be looked at but not worth the time
it is such a stark difference that no amount of caveats would matter - and the rest
would be similar -- offense was bottom of the barrel through 12 games last year
and this year it is at least middle of the pack.

I think these kinds of things play a large factor in looking at defense...they are
connected when the difference is so extreme.

And when and offense is bad -- Qb hurt, All-Pro WR hurt, online destroyed ...
it kills and offense and that kills a defense.
A lot fo 25th, 29th and 31sts from last year here

Rams offense from 2022 to 2023 though 12 games in both years
Points
2022 -29th
2023 - 13th

Yards
2022 - 31st
2023 - 13th

Pass yards
2022 - 25th
2023 - 15th

Pass rating
2022 - 27th
2023 - 22nd

Sack percentage allowed
2023 - 30th
2023 - 5th

Rushing Yards
2022 - 30th
2023 - 15th

Rushing yards per carry
2022 - 31st
2023 - 13th

3rd D
2022 - 16th
2023 - 13th

Just food for thought

 

[Tano]

Why blame his assistants? The blame belongs on McVay who is certainly responsible for how the defense should play. "Be aggressive" or "play soft". He's the head coach. If the Rams are playing aggressive D or soft D, it's what he wants.

Naw - Morris became overly cautious because the secondary assistants sucked and he tried to cover for them by playing extremely soft zones.

This year with better secondary coaches, Morris has played much more aggressive this year with very inexperience players no less.

Last year he had Ramsey and Hill (two experienced corners) and still played extremely soft.

 

[majrleaged]

The gameday thread is full of knee jerk reactions. Halfway through the 1st quarter people are ready to call the game a loss, and cut/fire half the team.

That thread is the true vent thread. I need it cause otherwise I piss off those who are watching with me.
That and the fire morris thread.

 

[JimY53]

I think we all know who the "Group 4" people are..... And I am not convinced you will get a response from them on this topic, but good luck.

Yeah, but they always reveal themselves. The difference is rational and irrational is easy to spot which is why they are a separate group. hate and ignorance are tightly connected.

Fairness and reason sound different, even if there is a disagreement. They are not overly emotional and angry. They usually have more basis in facts.

 

[WestCoastRam]

Somewhat affects the answer --- but aware of that, and is a fair point.
But I've found people don't like advanced stats that account for for those things.

But I will give you DVOA if you want it...DVOA, you can read about it...takes a lot of things into account
Here it is through 12 games
2022 = 16th
2023 = 19th

There were common opponents from 2022 to 2023 such as - Dallas, GB, plus divisional opponents
last year played the Bills, Bucs and Chiefs
this year Bengals, Eagles, Browns

So good teams both years, prob a bit better last year? Hard to say.

IMO not enough of a difference to affect the answer. I always try to only give stats in context--apples to apples. But you also have to use
things a lot of folks are familiar.

Bottom line is despite flaws in 2022 the defense didn't stink before Donald went down. After? Yes. Bad.
What I'd like is the group #4 to look at facts. Groups 1, 2, and 3 usually do and people can disagree

This stuff is mostly for any #4s around.

Who is this DVOA you speak of?

 

[JimY53]

Who is this DVOA you speak of?

Defensive-adjusted Value over Average = DVOA

a single number to rank an offense, defense, special teams unit ... taking into account more than just the usual yards, points, etc...accounts for as much as possible. As per Football Outsiders ... used quite a bit by analytics people. It's more or less a higher level of ranking a defense. Takes into account downs and distances an a lot more factors.

 

[WestCoastRam]

Defensive-adjusted Value over Average = DVOA

a single number to rank an offense, defense, special teams unit ... taking into account more than just the usual yards, points, etc...accounts for as much as possible. As per Football Outsiders ... used quite a bit by analytics people. It's more or less a higher level of ranking a defense. Takes into account downs and distances an a lot more factors.

Bad joke.

 

[JimY53]

Bad joke.

Sorry. Still new here. Don't know people's idiosyncrasies as per humor yet.

 

[WestCoastRam]

Sorry. Still new here. Don't know people's idiosyncrasies as per humor yet.

Don't be. Just know that my humor is grand. Men laugh, women become insatiably horny.

If you don't understand it just assume I'm playing 4D chess while other's see a nose tackle 2-gapping.

 

[Allen2McVay]

Just know that my humor is grand. Men laugh, women become insatiably horny.

Now THAT is fucking hilarious!

 

[WestCoastRam]

Now THAT is fucking hilarious!

See... you get my humor.

 

[Allen2McVay]

See... you get my humor.

I guess that is correct. As a man, I certainly did laugh.

I can not speak for women but they certainly have my deepest sympathy.