Stafford and those 2 first-rounders - worth it?

[Kupped]

Goff brings teams back from being down and if not for a couple screw ups on the defensive side - would have a few more wins on a really shitty team.

He is a winner and I do not consider Journeymen to be winners.

The flip to this is, of course, he's lost plenty of games on his own and cost the Rams a chance at the division title last year with catastrophic play.

Didn't feel like a "winner" to me in the Jets, 9ers, Miami games last year... at all.

 

[Tano]

Tom Brady
Justin Herbert
Derek Carr
Matt Stafford
Patrick Mahomes
Joe Burrow
Josh Allen
Kirk Cousins
Dak Prescott
Matt Ryan
Aaron Rogers
Kyler Murray
Trevor Lawrence
Jalen Hurts
Lamar Jackson
Russell Wilson

I think I'd slot Jared in just after that list.
I get that Lawrence is a rookie and his numbers aren't as good.. he's an incredible prospect and is already making plays in an absolutely HORRIFIC situation.

Jared's yards per attempt is really alarming.
Yep, he's not in a great situation either and I think, overall, Jared's performed a little better than expected.
Journeyman fits.

I would drop Derek Carr, Justin Herbert (I would put at the same level as Goff right now- could be better), Joe Burrow (same), Kirk Cousins (really?), Dak Prescott (plays well once in awhile - too erratic), Matt Ryan (losing it), Kyler Murray (sucks at the end of season when he can't run anymore), Trevor Lawrence (has talent but still unproven), Jalen Hurts (another runner who can't do anything else from what I see), Lamar Jackson (another running QB who if you keep in the pocket sucks)

 

[Kupped]

I have to disagree on that because when I looked at his sacks last year, they didn't have many receivers open that I could see in the All 22.

And their line is so much better this year with Allen/Corbett. Blythe was just terrible on some plays. I didn't call him THE MATADOR for nothing.

Corbett was on the line last year. What are you saying?

Who cares what you called him?

And.. you mean like Henderson streaking up the sideline wide open where Jared just overthrew him in a key moment? You mean like when Jared wasn't going through his reads properly?

I watched those games as well.. all of them.

 

[nighttrain]

Tom Brady
Justin Herbert
Derek Carr
Matt Stafford
Patrick Mahomes
Joe Burrow
Josh Allen
Jared Goff and Kirk Cousins
Dak Prescott
Matt Ryan
Aaron Rogers
Kyler Murray
Trevor Lawrence
Jalen Hurts
Lamar Jackson
Russell Wilson

 

[Merlin]

And that is something I will completely be in line on.

We shall see if he is a journeyman QB or if he is a good to very good QB after the next couple years because I believe Holmes is a really good GM and is putting Detroit on the right path.

So will Holmes be a fool if he drafts a QB in your opinion? Because I'm thinking the accolades we hear about him around here are gonna shift quite a bit if he moves on from Jared.

Also here are Goff's last 3 seasons. That is a good sample size for evaluation. So for myself a GM drafting a QB of the future this offseason would be understandable:

 

[Kupped]

I would drop Derek Carr, Justin Herbert (I would put at the same level as Goff right now- could be better), Joe Burrow (same), Kirk Cousins (really?), Dak Prescott (plays well once in awhile - too erratic), Matt Ryan (losing it), Kyler Murray (sucks at the end of season when he can't run anymore), Trevor Lawrence (has talent but still unproven), Jalen Hurts (another runner who can't do anything else from what I see), Lamar Jackson (another running QB who if you keep in the pocket sucks)

After reading this response, it's best I just stop with this interaction. Take care.

 

[Tano]

The flip to this is, of course, he's lost plenty of games on his own and cost the Rams a chance at the division title last year with catastrophic play.

Didn't feel like a "winner" to me in the Jets, 9ers, Miami games last year... at all.

I blame the Jets game on Blythe (he was absolutely terrible in that game), and the Miami game on McVays play calling - WR screens were there all day and they didn't take advantage until the 4th quarter when they called 3 WR screens on the same defensive alignment that was killing Goff in the first 3 quarters. Those WR screens each gained 15 yards. They could have called that play all day long against that specific defense by Miami. And whenever Goff wasn't facing that defense, he actually played well. But you could say that maybe Goff should have audible into it and you could be right - I don't know for sure.

I will agree that for some reason Shanahan has Goff's number

As to Stafford - you could say the same thing on the Titans 49ers and GB games where Stafford primarily lost those games because of his turnovers although the defense didn't play well in the 49er and GB game.

 

[André]

Back to the pure question: was the trade worth it?

The answer is, of course, to be determined. They made the move to go further in the playoffs - to win the Super Bowl. They decided that Goff couldn't do that for them and that Stafford could.

So, it's ultimately a pretty simple calculus: if the Rams win the Super Bowl in either or both of these two years, it's worth it. If they don't, it's not worth it. Because that was the purpose of the trade. The rest is just details.

 

[El Chapo Jr]

I would drop Derek Carr, Justin Herbert (I would put at the same level as Goff right now- could be better), Joe Burrow (same), Kirk Cousins (really?), Dak Prescott (plays well once in awhile - too erratic), Matt Ryan (losing it), Kyler Murray (sucks at the end of season when he can't run anymore), Trevor Lawrence (has talent but still unproven), Jalen Hurts (another runner who can't do anything else from what I see), Lamar Jackson (another running QB who if you keep in the pocket sucks)

Ok no way I'd take Goff over Herbert or Burrow. I'm sure many would agree there.

 

[nighttrain]

Ok no way I'd take Goff over Herbert or Burrow. I'm sure many would agree there.

Herbert or Burrow, two best young QB's in football
train

 

[Kupped]

Back to the pure question: was the trade worth it?

The answer is, of course, to be determined. They made the move to go further in the playoffs - to win the Super Bowl. They decided that Goff couldn't do that for them and that Stafford could.

So, it's ultimately a pretty simple calculus: if the Rams win the Super Bowl in either or both of these two years, it's worth it. If they don't, it's not worth it. Because that was the purpose of the trade. The rest is just details.

And that binary thought process is absolutely not one I'll be a part of.

Wayyyyyy more complex than that.

 

[El Chapo Jr]

Herbert or Burrow, two best young QB's in football
train

Agree, Burrow just demolished the Ravens for over 500 yards! Holy shit balls!

 

[Tano]

So will Holmes be a fool if he drafts a QB in your opinion? Because I'm thinking the accolades we hear about him around here are gonna shift quite a bit if he moves on from Jared.

Also here are Goff's last 3 seasons. That is a good sample size for evaluation. So for myself a GM drafting a QB of the future this offseason would be understandable:

View attachment 50680

Yes because there are no QBs in this year's draft that will be better than Goff imho.

It is kinda like how the Giants drafted a QB at number 6 when we all knew he was at best a 2nd round 3rd round QB

However, I would draft a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round if they have extra picks in those rounds because the lions do not have a backup QB

 

[Tano]

I don't think I have ever stated that Goff is a worse than average QB. You got the wrong guy. I support whoever is in horns, frustrations aside.

All good though man, we both love our team, I just move on from players once they are no longer wearing the horns.

Was going to give you a not so sure for the laughs lol

 

[Merlin]

I would drop Derek Carr, Justin Herbert (I would put at the same level as Goff right now- could be better), Joe Burrow (same), Kirk Cousins (really?), Dak Prescott (plays well once in awhile - too erratic), Matt Ryan (losing it), Kyler Murray (sucks at the end of season when he can't run anymore), Trevor Lawrence (has talent but still unproven), Jalen Hurts (another runner who can't do anything else from what I see), Lamar Jackson (another running QB who if you keep in the pocket sucks)

I think your love of Jared is coloring your take.

 

[Tano]

Agree, Burrow just demolished the Ravens for over 500 yards! Holy shit balls!

And Goff destroyed the Chiefs on that Monday night game.

When Burrows does good to great games on a more consistent basis then I would probably change my mind

 

[Tano]

I think your love of Jared is coloring your take.

Maybe but I have watched those QBs and don't see them significantly better than Goff. I should probably say that I would place Goff in that same range of QBs. Some days they are better and some days Goff is better

 

[El Chapo Jr]

And Goff destroyed the Chiefs on that Monday night game.

When Burrows does good to great games on a more consistent basis then I would probably change my mind

Yes that's true but which one is more recent? Goff hasn't had a game like that for ages. Sorry man, no comparison there. Many NFL experts and fans don't agree with you there, myself included.

 

[Tano]

Yes that's true but which one is more recent? Goff hasn't had a game like that for ages. Sorry man, no comparison there. Many NFL experts and fans don't agree with you there, myself included.

I thought Goff played a great game against Green Bay but every time they had a second or third and long in that game, Blythe and Evans would get demolished by their guy and Goff didn't stand a chance.

Go back and re-watch the 2nd and 3rd downs in that game if you don't believe me

 

[RamsSince1969]

Interesting conversation but a moot point obviously as it's done and there's no turning back..

Mikey, I agree. and my feelings are Stafford has been an absolute godsend! Yes Yes Yes Yes and Yes!