Softli not digging the offensive line's vibe right now

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[rp3]http://icestream.dev-cms.com:8000/stl/2012/08/08092012155838.mp3[/rp3]
http://www.101sports.com/templates/audi ... 076&type=s

[Loosely transcribed]

(Who starts at RT vs the Lions?)
Oh man, I don't have an answer for that. Right now, Boudreau is trying to find the right combination of players. Ojinnaka's been at right tackle, now he's at left today; Mattison was at right guard, now he's at left guard; Rok Watkins is now at right guard ... the only guys that are stable is Turner at center and Harvey Dahl at the Right Guard, so, they're one injury away from really shuffling things around, and I think they're trying to prepare for that now.

(On Wells. Do you know if this is his first surgery?)
That I cannot tell you. They're not talking surgery, they're talking about a surgical knee procedure. If you're referring to while he was in Green Bay, I don't know. Obviously he missed all of OTAs and minicamps. I saw him with Reggie working on the bag, on bands, they're moving him - moving his feet. The window of opportunity is the 2nd or 3rd game of preseason, so hopefully that'll be it.

(The 1999 Championship team had 18 undrafted free agents)
We did the same thing at Carolina. You have to hit on 3 or 4 of those guys. We've hit on some. A guy who really jumps out at me here is Sammy Brown. Long levers, very good laterally, but I haven't seen the physicality because they haven't been tackling. He moves around, good instincts, and I think he'll be one of those guys who blows up everything in his way.

(On Conrath - DT)
The one thing about him, he lacks girth. He's too tall I think to be in here. I like his frame, I like his get-off because it's low, but then he exposes his pads and he gets knocked back against double-teams. But he worked against Long, so maybe they see something a little different than I do. Solid effort, he's gonna give you 100%

(On Hoffman-Ellis)
He had 4 ints at Washington State. Good instincts over the middle. Another guy I'd like to see on special teams.

(On Jason Smith - if he's healthy, how can he not be the starter week 1?)
You know what? He's healthy now, and and and Chris Long is taking advantage of him on every play. He can't block him inside, outside, and you know what? It doesn't matter who they line up over Chris. But for me, grab him, hold him, whatever you gotta do ... but it's embarrassing how he's getting in that backfield too early and too fast. Neither one of these guys (Richardson/Smith) are playing worth a you-know-what right now.

:neh:

.

 

[PhxRam]

This Oline fiasco could be the undoing of a potentially great year.

 

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This Oline fiasco could be the undoing of a potentially great year.

Yeah, my concerns haven't been squelched much after listening to that. It's still early and all, and I hope Boudreau can pull everything together, but jeez. Either Chris Long is a Cyborg and will have 80 sacks this season, or nobody at RT is worth a shit right now.

I just have to keep repeating... "it's still early."

 

[Username]

Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

 

[PhxRam]

I had a game where I had something like 60 sacks using Kevin Greene in Tecmo Bowl.

This Oline fiasco could be the undoing of a potentially great year.

Yeah, my concerns haven't been squelched much after listening to that. It's still early and all, and I hope Boudreau can pull everything together, but jeez. Either Chris Long is a Cyborg and will have 80 sacks this season, or nobody at RT is worth a shit right now.

I just have to keep repeating... "it's still early."

 

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I had a game where I had something like 60 sacks using Kevin Greene in Tecmo Bowl.

Hacker. :sly:

 

[cfin5256]

I'm going to push the 'it's still early' mantra on myself as well. Hearing this kind of stuff can be depressing after last year. Sigh...

:what:

 

[Anonymous]

Main thing is, all they need--worst case--is 2010. That's the 2010 line, plus wells and dahl, plus the OTs with more experience. And that's worst case (ie. worst case in terms of personnel and execution).

How can the OL be WORSE than 2010 if it's the same guys plus 2 key additions plus more experience?

Of course 2010 meant--no injuries.

 

[-X-]

Main thing is, all they need--worst case--is 2010. That's the 2010 line, plus wells and dahl, plus the OTs with more experience. And that's worst case (ie. worst case in terms of personnel and execution).

How can the OL be WORSE than 2010 if it's the same guys plus 2 key additions plus more experience?

Of course 2010 meant--no injuries.

How's it the same guys when it's only the tackles?
And one of them (as described in this thread) is getting pwned.

I'll stay optimistic, and think happy thoughts, and ..... it's still early.

 

[RamsSince1969]

Sam can't handle getting killed back there. Hell, Superman might get his bell rung with a bad o-line on this team. We need some good luck for a change. I think this conditioning team of coaches this year is going to make a huge difference in the amount of injuries we obtain on the field. Didn't it seem like our guys were getting injured "walking to the mailbox" over the the last several years? Stretches and warmups are critical before a game. I feel we have a good bunch of coaches this year (including the head coach) who get that. We shall see how this plays out. Fingers crossed!

 

[DR RAM]

I won't pile on, but I am concerned.

 

[Anonymous]

Main thing is, all they need--worst case--is 2010. That's the 2010 line, plus wells and dahl, plus the OTs with more experience. And that's worst case (ie. worst case in terms of personnel and execution).

How can the OL be WORSE than 2010 if it's the same guys plus 2 key additions plus more experience?

Of course 2010 meant--no injuries.

How's it the same guys when it's only the tackles?
And one of them (as described in this thread) is getting pwned.

I'll stay optimistic, and think happy thoughts, and ..... it's still early.

I don't believe Smith is getting beaten the way some are saying. Actually there are different witnesses out at camp saying different things about that.

It's the same tackles, yeah. But of course that's significant in its own right. So I'll frame it that way.

Saffold and Smith were not liabilities in 2010. Now some people want to be skeptical about Smith, but, we have SEEN bad tackles and that includes the likes of John St. Clair and Grant Williams and Rex Tucker and Brandon Gorin and Phil Trautwein and Mark LeVoir so on. THAT is what BAD looks like. Smith was NEVER on that tier. He was always on the struggling to be consistent but with an upside tier.

So the tackles are more experienced. They have good inside support. They will have better TEs than they have had since they came here. The qb is more experienced which contributes to pass protection of course. Jackson was not himself in 2010 and he is himself now so unlike 2010 they should be able to run. Receivers.

So (and I know you know I think this) the worst case scenario, injuries aside, is that 2012 is a better 2010.

And why not. That seems to be like a legit "good worst case scenario."

 

[-X-]

Main thing is, all they need--worst case--is 2010. That's the 2010 line, plus wells and dahl, plus the OTs with more experience. And that's worst case (ie. worst case in terms of personnel and execution).

How can the OL be WORSE than 2010 if it's the same guys plus 2 key additions plus more experience?

Of course 2010 meant--no injuries.

How's it the same guys when it's only the tackles?
And one of them (as described in this thread) is getting pwned.

I'll stay optimistic, and think happy thoughts, and ..... it's still early.

I don't believe Smith is getting beaten the way some are saying. Actually there are different witnesses out at camp saying different things about that.

It's the same tackles, yeah. But of course that's significant in its own right. So I'll frame it that way.

Saffold and Smith were not liabilities in 2010. Now some people want to be skeptical about Smith, but, we have SEEN bad tackles and that includes the likes of John St. Clair and Grant Williams and Rex Tucker and so on.

So the tackles are more experience. They have good inside support. They will have better TEs than they have since they came here. The qb is more experienced which contributes to pass protection of course. Jackson was not himself in 2010 and he is himself now so unlike 2020 they should be able to run. Receivers.

So (and I know you know I think this) the worst case scenario, injuries aside, is that 2012 is a better 2010.

And why not. That seems to be like a legit "good worst case scenario."

Works for me.

Now make it happen, Cap'n.

 

[Anonymous]

Main thing is, all they need--worst case--is 2010. That's the 2010 line, plus wells and dahl, plus the OTs with more experience. And that's worst case (ie. worst case in terms of personnel and execution).

How can the OL be WORSE than 2010 if it's the same guys plus 2 key additions plus more experience?

Of course 2010 meant--no injuries.

How's it the same guys when it's only the tackles?
And one of them (as described in this thread) is getting pwned.

I'll stay optimistic, and think happy thoughts, and ..... it's still early.

I don't believe Smith is getting beaten the way some are saying. Actually there are different witnesses out at camp saying different things about that.

It's the same tackles, yeah. But of course that's significant in its own right. So I'll frame it that way.

Saffold and Smith were not liabilities in 2010. Now some people want to be skeptical about Smith, but, we have SEEN bad tackles and that includes the likes of John St. Clair and Grant Williams and Rex Tucker and so on.

So the tackles are more experience. They have good inside support. They will have better TEs than they have since they came here. The qb is more experienced which contributes to pass protection of course. Jackson was not himself in 2010 and he is himself now so unlike 2020 they should be able to run. Receivers.

So (and I know you know I think this) the worst case scenario, injuries aside, is that 2012 is a better 2010.

And why not. That seems to be like a legit "good worst case scenario."

Works for me.

Now make it happen, Cap'n.

On it.

 

[Yamahopper]

I won't pile on, but I am concerned.

I'm not piling on either. But yeah at this point I'm concerned too.

The concerning thing is Smith at times is the best tackle on the field.

 

[raised_fisT]

I get the feeling we're on the verge of a new ROD meme.
"It's still early"

Rams O-Line gives up 22 sacks in preseason Game 1. "It's still early"

:boing:

 

[Anonymous]

I won't pile on, but I am concerned.

I'm not piling on either. But yeah at this point I'm concerned too.

The concerning thing is Smith at times is the best tackle on the field.

But he isn't. Saffold is.

Saffold missed most of OTAs getting back into medically cleared playing shape. Ojinakka was the LOT through most of that. I think people sometimes forget that.

The OL has barely played together yet.

And as for Smith a lot of reports have him playing better than he has for a while.

Another reminder about 2010.

Not only were they fine then--they actually started out rocky. Smith had been hurt in OTAs and was unable to practice for a while. He started practicing a week before the first preseason game. That game they also played Fraley. It was against Minnesotta and the whole OL was shakey. Bradford got bounced around. In Ramsland there was rioting over it--fan panic went to defcon 1. Then the Patz preseason game came along in a couple of weeks, and they were fine. They were fine all season after that.

In 2012, all this OL has to do is be like that 2010 OL, and that's the worst case scenario.

 

[DR RAM]

Comparing years isn't going to help the Rams. There is no comparison. This group is this group. Smith playing better than before doesn't make me warm and fuzzy, for he had a LOT of room to improve. His improving doesn't mean he's good all of a sudden. His reported improvement is him being compared to himself, in a practice situation, it doesn't mean anything until we see it on the field. Other reports have Smith losing reps to Richardson, who certainly is no stall-worth at tackle, which doesn't mean that he or Smith won't "get it", they are still young.

But with their play and Saffold's injury, which I think yamahopper was referring to, I'm concerned.

The offensive line should be greater than their sum of parts, so the players don't really matter if they can't gel and be a cohesive group on the field. It's not a plug and play situation.

I'm not saying the sky is falling. I am saying that I am concerned. There are a lot of questions about this unit, more than any other unit on the field.

 

[Yamahopper]

I won't pile on, but I am concerned.

I'm not piling on either. But yeah at this point I'm concerned too.

The concerning thing is Smith at times is the best tackle on the field.

But he isn't. Saffold is.

Saffold missed most of OTAs getting back into medically cleared playing shape. Ojinakka was the LOT through most of that. I think people sometimes forget that.

The OL has barely played together yet.

And as for Smith a lot of reports have him playing better than he has for a while.

Another reminder about 2010.

Not only were they fine then--they actually started out rocky. Smith had been hurt in OTAs and was unable to practice for a while. He started practicing a week before the first preseason game. That game they also played Fraley. It was against Minnesotta and the whole OL was shakey. Bradford got bounced around. In Ramsland there was rioting over it--fan panic went to defcon 1. Then the Patz preseason game came along in a couple of weeks, and they were fine. They were fine all season after that.

In 2012, all this OL has to do is be like that 2010 OL, and that's the worst case scenario.

Well after seeing the scrimmage and a few practices lets put it this way. Smith lets long has his way with him. but he always gets a gets a piece of him and slows him down a little. Saffold wiffs several times on Quinn and Sims giving them a clean kill shot on Bradford.
Saffold has improved before being held back. Smith has regressed Since the pads came on.

Just cause they played a certain way 2 years ago doesn't mean they can play that way now.

There is 4 weeks before the first game so as they digest the new system and improve their foot work and positioning. Saffold will return to his level I'm sure.

Smith regresses any more and he will get cut.
This is a process and it will take weeks for the players to reach their max Q. But any previous season has no bearing on this season.

 

[Anonymous]

Comparing years isn't going to help the Rams. There is no comparison. This group is this group. Smith playing better than before doesn't make me warm and fuzzy, for he had a LOT of room to improve. His improving doesn't mean he's good all of a sudden. His reported improvement is him being compared to himself, in a practice situation, it doesn't mean anything until we see it on the field. Other reports have Smith losing reps to Richardson, who certainly is no stall-worth at tackle, which doesn't mean that he or Smith won't "get it", they are still young.

But with their play and Saffold's injury, which I think yamahopper was referring to, I'm concerned.

The offensive line should be greater than their sum of parts, so the players don't really matter if they can't gel and be a cohesive group on the field. It's not a plug and play situation.

I'm not saying the sky is falling. I am saying that I am concerned. There are a lot of questions about this unit, more than any other unit on the field.

Sure comparisons are very effective.

They tell you what the bottom line expectation is when you have these 2 tackles.

And offense with these 2 tackles held up in 2010 when everyone else around the OL on offense was either young or broken.

Injuries aside, it's normal to expect AT LEAST that again--only now there are more players plus they have gained experience.

See, this is a WORST CASE SCENARIO I am painting here. So if you say well Smith wasn't an all-pro in 2010, then, I say--exactly. And they got by fine with some bad circumstances. Why shouldn't we expect AT LEAST that in 2012, and that's the WORST CASE.

As for gelling and being cohesive--everyone is acting like they know the deadline on that. Was it last week? Today? Meanwhile as I said in 2010, they came out fine--even though the actual OL they fielded that season had not even come together yet by the first preseason game. They looked very shakey in preason game one, looked fine in game 3 against the Patz, and looked fine from then on too. That means basically they came together as a unit in 3 weeks.

Heck Boudreau had a line in 2006 that, cause of injuries, didn't stabilize until the 10th game--and when it did stabilize, it was with a center who had not even been in training camp, let alone OTAs (they signed him during the season).