To be fair, no one team can keep all of it's best players. One could argue that locking up Tavon over Jenkins is questionable, but at the same time the defense is loaded compared to the offense here.
Jeff Fisher is expected back as Rams coach next year
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Bart, it seems like you aren't reading my posts if you think I insulted you. I'll repost it here:
That's agreement, Bart. I'm agreeing with you that they should have played Mannion last year. It really feels like you didn't take the time to read my post before responding. That tells me we're at the end of useful discussion here. Not much to be gained. Best to call it an impasse and move on.
Foles was a mistake. So we drafted Goff...and then Fisher promptly made no effort to get him up to speed for Week 1 and chose to start Keenum until he gets us eliminated from playoff contention. That's unforgivable. He made the same exact mistake, except he actually has a #1 overall QB on the team right. But he still continues to do what he always does.
That says enough for me. Fisher isn't going to change. These aren't mistakes. They're simply Fisher's flaws as a coach showing.
I ignored your questions because they weren't relevant. Fisher didn't lose his starting QB. He had his starting QB in 2015. He has his starting QB in 2016. He's still losing. The lack of a top QB on this team falls directly on Fisher's shoulders. He's been here for 5 years. He actually brought in a guy who could be a top QB, but he refuses to play that guy.
Instead, he starts a limited backup caliber QB over him. Why? My opinion is that he is doing it out of self-preservation. He knows that he has no excuse if he plays Goff and loses. He can use Goff as a bargaining chip if he doesn't play him this year until we're out of the playoff hunt. Why? Because one of two things happens:
1. Goff plays well and wins which allows Fisher to claim that he should be brought back because we'll win with Goff in 2017 and we shouldn't hurt Goff's development by bringing in a new staff; or
2. Goff struggles and Fisher gets to claim he was right to bench Goff.
This is a move that isn't for the benefit of the Rams. It's for the benefit of Jeff Fisher.
Fisher's stubbornness is incompetence. He's hurting the team by taking the course of action he has. That is incompetence as a Head Coach.
Which comes right back to the same issue from before. There's only two options here:
1. We have tremendous talent, and Fisher is underachieving by only winning 6-7 games a year; or
2. We don't have tremendous talent.
Teams with tremendous talent don't lose more games than they win unless their coach is incompetent. You can't insist that Fisher is good at his job and has tremendous talent when this team can't put together a winning season. That reasoning doesn't hold up.
I read it as it was stupid for me to want to see Mannion last year. I stand corrected
When Goff plays and he shows he is a franchise QB its forgivable to me.
Since when is trying to develop a QB a flaw? There are examples of rookie QBs who sat for some games or a year and developed to be Franchise QBs, just as there are examples or rookie QBs playing week 1 and end up being franchise QBs. Just because you or I don't agree with fisher choosing the former option doesn't make it a coaching flaw.
Or maybe he isn't worried about politics and, instead, is actually trying to get his #1 pick ready to handle the hardest position in all of sports.
So choosing to let Goff develop on the bench for some games or a year and we not agreeing with his approach is incompetence? Yea, no.
Let me ask you the same question I asked somebody else but they refused to answer.
If Fisher returns and Goff starts and we go on to be perennial winners does it really matter if Goff sat on the bench his first year? Will fisher still be incompetent?
It goes back to my previous point. A top team can have tremendous talent all around, but take away their franchise QB and tell me how many games they win?
Fisher has built a talented roster. He has his franchise QB waiting in the wings. I don't like it, you don't like it, but we don't have a choice. I want to see what Goff can do before I get out my pitchfork.
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What does Bradford have to do with it? Moving the goal posts? I'm not chasing you down the rabbit hole Alice.
Spags won 7 games, and that's the best Fisher could do even with a dramatically improved roster. Other coaches have faced equally poor situations and turned them around quickly. Fisher is on year 5, which is the definition of "not quickly"
Except this is disingenuous in thinking that they became Franchise QB because they sat for a year or two.
Not true at all. What is true is in the few examples in the last 20 years the team had a viable option to play in lieu of the rookie QB. Be it a Brett Favre, Drew Brees, Kurt Warner or even a Jon Kitna. The Rams don't have a viable option, instead they have a journeyman QB who has the 2nd highest INT and amongst lowest QB rating
Yeah and if you had read my previous posts you would have known that I mentioned bill belichicks pats were probably the only exception.
All you do is try to start arguments on points I'm not even making. I never said that they became franchise QBs because they sat on the bench. I said there are examples where franchise QBs have sat some games or a year and ended up becoming franchise QBs. Whether sitting on the bench is what made them franchise QBs is irrelevant. Having a viable option before Goff starts is also irrelevant because I wasn't arguing that.
Look man I know you want fisher gone and you are always tying to spin things to fit your opinion. I understand why people don't want to see him back. I get it. I just want to see Goff play before I jump on that wagon. If he succeeds then Fisher succeeds simple as that.
but on the other side of this discussion. fisher had a big budget to spend on his coaching staff he had extra picks from rg3 trade. he had 2 more years then most coaches get. so the good cancels out the bad. we can think he should be extended or fired but that is just an opinion but here is a fact he is about to become the all time most losing coach and the coach he will pass has far more wins. that alone tells me we should replace him
I'm not trying to spin anything. Fisher is on his way to his 5th straight losing season and no coach in 50 years has kept his job after 3 straight. That's a fact. Now coming up with reasons why he should get another shot? THAT requires spin.
And the idea that recent qb have sat on the bench for a season and became franchise qb is just not true. At least Not top 5 1st rounders and not first rounders who teams traded the farm for.
So spare the accusations of "spin" when someone is supporting their assertion with fact.
My Sources
UDFA
I really have a difficult time understanding why anyone would want Fisher back. As far as I'm concerned, Snead needs to go as well. The stubborn way that management utilized its bounty of draft picks is deplorable. Moreover, this team remains boring and unwatchable. The only thing worse than watching a perennial loser is watching a BORING perennial loser. That's all on management and needs to change quickly or they will lose their fan base.
You said
and now
I never said they became franchise QBs because they sat on the bench, I never brought up having a viable option, I never said recent QBs, 1st round QBs, or QBs who's team traded the farm for. All I said was
That is indeed a fact.Young Ram said:
So who exactly is trying to spin the argument? Your straw man fallacy is strong with this one.
dieterbrock said:
So its OK to come up with reasons why Fisher needs to go but on the contrary its not?
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