The St. Louis Cardinals MegaThread.

[Tano]

Cardinals dealing Dustin May and JoJo Romero to the Brewers!

It's happening!!!

(Please let this be another Brock for Broglio.)

I guess Dustin May went back to his bad habits.

 

[Memento]

I guess Dustin May went back to his bad habits.

Actually pitched really well for us. Not a #1 at all, but definitely #2 for us. Romero is our best reliever. I love the return (Alexander Frias looks like a potential superstar; only eighteen, 6'2", 177 lbs., and he's got a 100 percentile exit velocity), and I'm starting to turn around on the guy I don't like from the Milwaukee trade (Josiah Ragsdale, who is having a total 180 to where he was as a prospect last year. Brewers fans were apparently pissed at the trade, wanted Frias, in particular, to be a part of a Skubal trade to them, which says a whole hell of a lot.

Now we had a trade with Arizona: we sent Lars Nootbaar to them for Daniel Eagen (their #5 prospect, right-handed pitcher with a plus changeup and slider, above-average fastball, really weird over-the-top pitching delivery) and Sandro Santana (left-handed likely reliever with a 70-grade slider), as well as a PTBNL. Both Eagen and Santana are in Double-A, so they could be up soonish, especially with a good year next year.

We also had a trade with Cincinnati: we got Caleb Ferguson (left-handed reliever) for international bonus money (money that we didn't exactly need, since we've found a lot of studs for less money than the superstars: Rainiel Rodriguez was $300,000, Miguel Hernandez was $500,000, Sebastian Dos Santos was $75,000, just for three examples). We needed the reliever since Bruihl has been ass all season long and Romero is now a Brewer.

 

[Tano]

Actually pitched really well for us. Not a #1 at all, but definitely #2 for us. Romero is our best reliever. I love the return (Alexander Frias looks like a potential superstar; only eighteen, 6'2", 177 lbs., and he's got a 100 percentile exit velocity), and I'm starting to turn around on the guy I don't like from the Milwaukee trade (Josiah Ragsdale, who is having a total 180 to where he was as a prospect last year. Brewers fans were apparently pissed at the trade, wanted Frias, in particular, to be a part of a Skubal trade to them, which says a whole hell of a lot.

Now we had a trade with Arizona: we sent Lars Nootbaar to them for Daniel Eagen (their #5 prospect, right-handed pitcher with a plus changeup and slider, above-average fastball, really weird over-the-top pitching delivery) and Sandro Santana (left-handed likely reliever with a 70-grade slider), as well as a PTBNL. Both Eagen and Santana are in Double-A, so they could be up soonish, especially with a good year next year.

We also had a trade with Cincinnati: we got Caleb Ferguson (left-handed reliever) for international bonus money (money that we didn't exactly need, since we've found a lot of studs for less money than the superstars: Rainiel Rodriguez was $300,000, Miguel Hernandez was $500,000, Sebastian Dos Santos was $75,000, just for three examples). We needed the reliever since Bruihl has been ass all season long and Romero is now a Brewer.

Caleb Ferguson was a Dodger and did pretty well for us.

 

[Memento]

@PARAM - Huge fan of the game last night! Burleson went utterly nuts with three homers and six RBIs. Lots of deep flies from both teams, but Burly stole the show.

And to think he was a possible trade chip during the deadline. It's still possible he and/or Ivan Herrera get dealt in the offseason, but I love them both and how they've played. They're seriously underrated sluggers behind Walker and Wetherholt. Walker even got a few hits (still waiting on his first homer since the All-Star break, a little concerned about that), and Wetherholt keeps getting on base at a nice clip.

Hopefully the voters see the nuances between J.J. and Sal Stewart and vote Wetherholt over the power-hitter who gets more numbers in the clean-up spot in a bandbox of a park. Wetherholt leads all NL second basemen in WAR and all second basemen in the MLB, and almost all of the league, regardless of position in OOA. His WAR rating is mainly outstanding defense and baserunning, but he doesn't trail Stewart by much in almost every offensive category (and leads in OBP), except for RBIs, and the only reason he's way back in RBIs because of his leadoff spot compared to the clean-up spot and, yes, the bandbox helping, as compared to our stadium that is one of the biggest pitchers parks.

But yeah, loved the game, excited for the next two.

Caleb Ferguson was a Dodger and did pretty well for us.

Awesome to hear he did well with you. Hopefully that Dodgers magic goes with him in his Cardinal tenure, maybe a potential re-signing, if possible.

But in other news with Ferguson, I know he got in a huge spat with umpire Bill Miller (said some really awful words about his age and weight that were way out of line, even for a normal player-umpire interaction. Miller, to his credit, didn't throw him out when a more thin-skinned umpire would have without hesitation, but his expression did show that the words hurt him). It was men on base, Miller accidentally got in the way of a hit ball and the shortstop that he couldn't avoid, Ferguson got pissed, and said a lot of low-blow comments towards Miller in the heat of the moment. Still, to Ferguson's credit, he did apologize to Miller personally and expressed his remorse in a media interview.

That's how I want umpires to be to players: respectful, understanding why they're frustrated, handling the managers well and not antagonizing them. I know Miller's really old (in his sixties), but he's been an umpire for almost thirty years, and actually is still one of the better umps in the game, even if his reflexes aren't what they used to be.

 

[Coliseum Ram]

Here ya go Memento babe, I believe you referenced a couple of these guys the other day (Clarke, Fitts) when you were spouting how the Cardinals "fleeced" the Red Sox on this trade. Do you honestly want to call the Sonny Gray acquisition, with his 14-2 record and sub-3.00 ERA a LOSS for Breslow?????!!!!!!


View: https://x.com/i/status/2085462922130604206

 

[Memento]

Here ya go Memento babe, I believe you referenced a couple of these guys the other day (Clarke, Fitts) when you were spouting how the Cardinals "fleeced" the Red Sox on this trade. Do you honestly want to call the Sonny Gray acquisition, with his 14-2 record and sub-3.00 ERA a LOSS for Breslow?????!!!!!!


View: https://x.com/i/status/2085462922130604206

Gray's only signed for this year and is thirty-six years old, while Fitts and Clarke both still have five/six years of control remaining (after Clarke becomes Rule 5 eligible after this season. There's plenty of time to equal Sonny Gray's WAR for this year vs. Fitts's and Clarke's WAR for five/six more major league years.

Also? Wins are a seriously overrated stat because a pitcher really might not have to do much to earn them (for example, the starting pitcher on the winning team might've given up six or seven runs in five innings, while the other team goes to a reliever after their starter gives up a ton more runs).

Now, if you're talking quality starts, that's a different story that paints a more accurate picture than wins alone. Gray has thirteen quality starts. Very good. 2.8 WAR as of now and pacing towards 3.6 fWAR? Also good, but there's plenty of time for both Fitts and Clarke to get to the Majors (get back in Fitts's case; he's out for this year with a lat tear) and equal that in five/six years of control.

So, while Gray is a win for you guys at the moment, the second he's not signed, his WAR for this trade ends, and if you do re-sign him, he'll be thirty-seven at the start of that contract, and not every pitcher pitches well at thirty-seven, and he's had injuries pop up throughout his career.

And aside from all of that...if you do recall, I think I stated that Rutschman was a potential fleecing of Breslow, that trading Mayer was a fleecing of Breslow, that trading Early was a fleecing of Breslow. If I did state that the Gray and Contreras trades were fleecings, it's my bad for not explaining my position more, and why I feel so confident about them.

Gray and Contreras are good this year, but Gray's contract is finished after this year, and Contreras's contract is done in 2027 - and both of them will be a year older, another year with more wear and tear, another year of possibly not being the players they were.

 

[Coliseum Ram]

Gray's only signed for this year and is thirty-six years old, while Fitts and Clarke both still have five/six years of control remaining (after Clarke becomes Rule 5 eligible after this season. There's plenty of time to equal Sonny Gray's WAR for this year vs. Fitts's and Clarke's WAR for five/six more major league years.

Also? Wins are a seriously overrated stat because a pitcher really might not have to do much to earn them (for example, the starting pitcher on the winning team might've given up six or seven runs in five innings, while the other team goes to a reliever after their starter gives up a ton more runs).

Now, if you're talking quality starts, that's a different story that paints a more accurate picture than wins alone. Gray has thirteen quality starts. Very good. 2.8 WAR as of now and pacing towards 3.6 fWAR? Also good, but there's plenty of time for both Fitts and Clarke to get to the Majors (get back in Fitts's case; he's out for this year with a lat tear) and equal that in five/six years of control.

So, while Gray is a win for you guys at the moment, the second he's not signed, his WAR for this trade ends, and if you do re-sign him, he'll be thirty-seven at the start of that contract, and not every pitcher pitches well at thirty-seven, and he's had injuries pop up throughout his career.

And aside from all of that...if you do recall, I think I stated that Rutschman was a potential fleecing of Breslow, that trading Mayer was a fleecing of Breslow, that trading Early was a fleecing of Breslow. If I did state that the Gray and Contreras trades were fleecings, it's my bad for not explaining my position more, and why I feel so confident about them.

Gray and Contreras are good this year, but Gray's contract is finished after this year, and Contreras's contract is done in 2027 - and both of them will be a year older, another year with more wear and tear, another year of possibly not being the players they were.

But they are both GREAT for us this year. The guys you got for them will be marginal.. Fitts is an "old" minor-leaguer.

And BTW, Early already shut down by Wash with elbow discomfort.

The Red Sox train rolls on......

 

[Memento]

But they are both GREAT for us this year. The guys you got for them will be marginal.. Fitts is an "old" minor-leaguer.

And BTW, Early already shut down by Wash with elbow discomfort.

The Red Sox train rolls on......

Fitts and Dobbins are twenty-six/twenty-seven. Hardly old. And both of them have reached the majors and have pitched enough to the point where they're no longer prospects.

And Mead's still out with a hand injury (which, like I said and like wrist injuries, are as voodoo to a hitter as much as shoulders are voodoo to pitchers. Hand and wrist injuries affect the batting profile of a player, how they grip the bat, how they can let loose on pitches with confidence, and all of that without pain. It's the main reason why one of the Cardinals first-round busts, Nick Plummer, failed; he had a hand injury from a pitch that broke his hand, and he never recovered from it.).

Mead will likely recover; the question is how long he'll be out and after coming back, how long will it take until he's effective at the plate again.

 

[Coliseum Ram]

Fitts and Dobbins are twenty-six/twenty-seven. Hardly old. And both of them have reached the majors and have pitched enough to the point where they're no longer prospects.

And Mead's still out with a hand injury (which, like I said and like wrist injuries, are as voodoo to a hitter as much as shoulders are voodoo to pitchers. Hand and wrist injuries affect the batting profile of a player, how they grip the bat, how they can let loose on pitches with confidence, and all of that without pain. It's the main reason why one of the Cardinals first-round busts, Nick Plummer, failed; he had a hand injury from a pitch that broke his hand, and he never recovered from it.).

Mead will likely recover; the question is how long he'll be out and after coming back, how long will it take until he's effective at the plate again.

Mead's hand injury came after the fact. What does that have to do with the trade itself?

Mead will join this buzzsaw, late September, then Sox have 5 years of control. Early will be an elbow injury case with a 4th starter ceiling.

 

[Memento]

Mead's hand injury came after the fact. What does that have to do with the trade itself?

Mead will join this buzzsaw, late September, then Sox have 5 years of control. Early will be an elbow injury case with a 4th starter ceiling.

Mead's hand injury came the day he debuted with the Sox. It has a lot to do with the trade, since it means that he's going to spend some time recovering - and he wasn't exactly lighting the world on fire with the Rays, White Sox, or Nationals: career slash line of .244/.321/.388, and twenty-two career homers (albeit with a career high of seventeen this year).

Maybe he's figured it out, but now he's got a fractured wrist to deal with, which, again, is voodoo for hitters.

As for Early, way too early (pun not intended) to call his career and even a reliable fourth starter is valuable in this league. Truthfully, it's way too soon to call either of their careers, but we'll see how both of them recover from their injuries (and elbows and Tommy John are easier for pitchers - not guaranteed, but easier - than wrists are for hitters, speaking from experience; I believe the Cardinals also had a wrist surgery with Dylan Carlson as well, and he never truly recovered from it either).

 

[Coliseum Ram]

Mead's hand injury came the day he debuted with the Sox. It has a lot to do with the trade, since it means that he's going to spend some time recovering - and he wasn't exactly lighting the world on fire with the Rays, White Sox, or Nationals: career slash line of .244/.321/.388, and twenty-two career homers (albeit with a career high of seventeen this year).

Maybe he's figured it out, but now he's got a fractured wrist to deal with, which, again, is voodoo for hitters.

As for Early, way too early (pun not intended) to call his career and even a reliable fourth starter is valuable in this league. Truthfully, it's way too soon to call either of their careers, but we'll see how both of them recover from their injuries (and elbows and Tommy John are easier for pitchers - not guaranteed, but easier - than wrists are for hitters, speaking from experience; I believe the Cardinals also had a wrist surgery with Dylan Carlson as well, and he never truly recovered from it either).

Yeah, but you keep EQUATING the injury as part of the trade ITSELF. We will deal with the injury, his replacement, and his 5 years remaining with Sox happily.

 

[Memento]

Yeah, but you keep EQUATING the injury as part of the trade ITSELF. We will deal with the injury, his replacement, and his 5 years remaining with Sox happily. Worry about your Cards, and making the Playoffs again one day.

Oh, I certainly will; we're a team on the rise. Remember: the Cards were expected to be a bottom five team, last in the Central, with a lot of their players supposed to be bad or traded, and they're currently in a position to compete for the final NL Wild Card in a difficult NL competition.

OH, and we got a lot of awesome prospects from the Draft and savvy trades - both at the Deadline and not.

Again, thank you for Yhoiker Fajardo; he's already in Double-A as the third-youngest player in Double-A (to Jesus Made of the Brewers and Rainiel Rodriguez, also of the Cards), and the youngest pitcher there! Blake Aita's also in Double-A as well (and pitched an outstanding 6.1 inning game with five hits, zero walks and one run in his latest start), so thank you for him, too! Clarke would be in Double-A, too if it weren't for Double-A's enormous list of talented pitchers (he's in High-A because they want to see what his stuff is), and he became the second lefty pitcher - along with Aroldis Chapman - to reach 103 mph on multiple fastballs, and has a nasty wipeout slider as well. Huge potential. And that's not even getting into Dobbins and Fitts potentially pitching next year (or this year, in Dobbins' case).

Again, that's just the prospects we got from the Sox; we got lots of talented prospects from the Mariners, the Brewers, the Diamondbacks, and the Draft.

It's going to take a fair bit, of course, but I believe we're going to compete for championships sooner than anyone expects. Hell, even I didn't anticipate a lot of the things that happened this year (Jordan Walker resurrecting his career from the grave, Wetherholt being a potential ROTY, Burleson and Herrera continuing to excel, the starting pitching staff pitching well above their weight, even with a down year from Liberatore, etc.), and I was expecting a lot less than what they did.

If you told me that Masyn Winn would have a down year in hitting, that the bullpen was terrible, that Liberatore would have a bad year, and that Nolan Gorman and Victor Scott II would both be sent down after poor years at the beginning of the year, I'd assume that I would've been right that my Cardinals would be at the bottom of the MLB standings. To know that all of that happened and they're still in the race for the Wild Card? That's far beyond my wildest hopes and expectations at the start of the year.

You're damn right I'm confident we're going to be competing soon!

 

[Coliseum Ram]

Oh, I certainly will; we're a team on the rise. Remember: the Cards were expected to be a bottom five team, last in the Central, with a lot of their players supposed to be bad or traded, and they're currently in a position to compete for the final NL Wild Card in a difficult NL competition.

OH, and we got a lot of awesome prospects from the Draft and savvy trades - both at the Deadline and not.

Again, thank you for Yhoiker Fajardo; he's already in Double-A as the third-youngest player in Double-A (to Jesus Made of the Brewers and Rainiel Rodriguez, also of the Cards), and the youngest pitcher there! Blake Aita's also in Double-A as well (and pitched an outstanding 6.1 inning game with five hits, zero walks and one run in his latest start), so thank you for him, too! Clarke would be in Double-A, too if it weren't for Double-A's enormous list of talented pitchers (he's in High-A because they want to see what his stuff is, and he became the second lefty pitcher - along with Aroldis Chapman - to reach 103 mph on multiple fastballs, and has a nasty wipeout slider as well. Huge potential. And that's not even getting into Dobbins and Fitts potentially pitching next year (or this year, in Dobbins' case).

Again, that's just the prospects we got from the Sox; we got lots of talented prospects from the Mariners, the Brewers, the Diamondbacks, and the Draft.

It's going to take a fair bit, of course, but I believe we're going to compete for championships sooner than anyone expects. Hell, even I didn't anticipate a lot of the things that happened this year (Jordan Walker resurrecting his career from the grave, Wetherholt being a potential ROTY, Burleson and Herrera continuing to excel, the starting pitching staff pitching well above their weight, even with a down year from Liberatore, etc.), and I was expecting a lot less than what they did.

If you told me that Masyn Winn would have a down year in hitting, that the bullpen was terrible, that Liberatore would have a bad year, and that Nolan Gorman and Victor Scott II would both be sent down after poor years at the beginning of the year, I'd assume that I would've been right that my Cardinals would be at the bottom of the MLB standings. To know that all of that happened and they're still in the race for the Wild Card? That's far beyond my wildest hopes and expectations at the start of the year.

You're damn right I'm confident we're going to be competing soon!

That's great. Hope ya do. Thats no reason to bash the Sox for acquiring MLB talents Gray and Contreras just to hope to make your team look good. Sox made great moves on both deals, regardless of how Cards turned out.

Think Stafford and Garrett trades. BOTH teams are happy.

 

[Memento]

That's great. Hope ya do. Thats no reason to bash the Sox for acquiring MLB talents Gray and Contreras just to hope to make your team look good. Sox made great moves on both deals, regardless of how Cards turned out.

Think Stafford and Garrett trades. BOTH teams are happy.

Fair enough~ Wasn't meaning to bash the Sox; just gave my honest thoughts on the Rutschman and Mead trades mostly.

 

[Memento]

Shoot, forgot about Blaze Jordan! @Coliseum Ram

He's in the Majors and doing well for us at third! He's not amazing, but he's holding the door at third base. I know he was a major part of the first Bloom wave when he was the Red Sox GM (picked him in the third-round as a high schooler in 2020, gave him a well-overslot bonus). He admittedly struggled for a while in the minors, but I'm glad we have him now.

So, yes, thank you for him, too!



Also have to thank the Mets and Rangers for what they gave us at the Deadline last year, too.

 

[Memento]

JOSHUA BAEZ WITH FUCKING HISTORY! THREE HOMERS IN HIS FIRST THREE AT BATS (ONLY PLAYER TO EVER DO THAT), AND THE FIRST CARDINALS ROOKIE IN TWENTY-SIX YEARS TO HOMER ON THE FIRST PITCH OF HIS FIRST AT-BAT!

HOLY. FUCKING. SHIT!