Kadarius Toney available via trade

[El Chapo Jr]

@El Chapo Jr.

VJ was the #2 in the 2nd half of the SB.

Woods (#2) played from week 1 through week 9
OBJ (#2) played from week 10 through the first half of the Superbowl

The only time when VJ was the #2, until the very end was OBJ's first two games. VJ had 6 receptions for 147 yards (24.5 yds/rec) and a TD.

I wouldn't call that being a true #2 because OBJ is still on the field and demands attention regardless. VJ sample size is small but he definitely didn't show much in the 2nd half of the SB. There is always the possibility that he makes a jump in year 3 so I could be wrong too. Personally I hope he does as that only allows us to use him as a valuable trade chip after next year. Either way, thx for the stats. I hadn't had my coffee yet and I'm the walking dead til then hahaha

 

[PARAM]

VJ sample size is small but he definitely didn't show much in the 2nd half of the SB.

He was targeted 4 times in the 2nd half of the SB (2 rec). Three of them were within 5 yards of the LOS and 1 was deep. Cincinnati had 2 receivers to concern themselves with in the 2nd half of the SB. Kupp first (6 targets in the 2nd half), then VJ next (4 targets). May be why Hendo (2), Hopkins (3), Akers (3) and Skowronek (4) got more than half the 2nd half targets.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Not so sure that happened, in the last 8 games of the reg season, Van went 23 catches, 369 yards and 3 TD. Pretty much the same

He had an opportunity for an increased role and pretty much did the same.

 

[PARAM]

So VJ had an opportunity for an "increased role"? From #3 behind Kupp and Woods to #3 behind Kupp and OBJ. Damn shame the guy didn't take advantage of that!

 

[MachS]

So VJ had an opportunity for an "increased role"? From #3 behind Kupp and Woods to #3 behind Kupp and OBJ. Damn shame the guy didn't take advantage of that!

You don't think Van should've had an obvious uptick in production after the OBJ signing while OBJ was learning the offense and building chemistry with Stafford? He had a few nice games but when you look at the film and stats down the stretch, our last 8 games including the 4 playoff games he was virtually invisible. And it's not like he didn't have the targets. 6 targets vs MIN, 5 vs BAL, 5 vs SF, and 8 vs CIN. His playoff run was especially bad and his inability to fight for balls lead to multiple turnovers for Stafford.

No one is saying he's a bad player. He's a solid #3 in the NFL, but if you have an ability to upgrade the position with a younger, more talented player you should obviously take it. Many around here weren't happy with the Woods trade and ARob replacement. But ARob is a more talented WR. Does that mean he's the leader or blocker Woods is? No. But looking at their game as a whole he's got more talent and I think there's an even bigger difference with Toney vs Jefferson. You should never be against upgrading talent on your roster as long as it doesn't affect the overall culture or locker room stability of a team. To me the only argument that can be made against Toney is his maturity and fit culture wise, there shouldn't be an argument for not trading Jefferson if it lands us a more talented receiver.

 

[MachS]

He was targeted 4 times in the 2nd half of the SB (2 rec). Three of them were within 5 yards of the LOS and 1 was deep. Cincinnati had 2 receivers to concern themselves with in the 2nd half of the SB. Kupp first (6 targets in the 2nd half), then VJ next (4 targets). May be why Hendo (2), Hopkins (3), Akers (3) and Skowronek (4) got more than half the 2nd half targets.

There was no separation vs man coverage. Go back and watch the film my dude it's pretty obvious. That was the most frustrating part of his performance was not being able to win his 1-on-1s. I think that's the concern right now - if Kupp or ARob go down in 2022, teams will bracket our top WR and force Van to win against man coverage which he hasn't been able to do consistently when asked to.

 

[CGI_Ram]

Jefferson very easily could have had the Super Bowl winning TD.

25 sec mark.


View: https://youtu.be/0_3IxEGCakE

 

[PhillyRam]

There was no separation vs man coverage. Go back and watch the film my dude it's pretty obvious. That was the most frustrating part of his performance was not being able to win his 1-on-1s. I think that's the concern right now - if Kupp or ARob go down in 2022, teams will bracket our top WR and force Van to win against man coverage which he hasn't been able to do consistently when asked to.

He did have a knee issue... hoping that was a big part of his problem.

 

[El Chapo Jr]

Jefferson very easily could have had the Super Bowl winning TD.

25 sec mark.


View: https://youtu.be/0_3IxEGCakE

Not trying to crap on what your saying because it's true, but to me that looks like McVay scheming him open on that one.

 

[dieterbrock]

You don't think Van should've had an obvious uptick in production after the OBJ signing while OBJ was learning the offense and building chemistry with Stafford?

Not really, because they clearly wanted to build chemistry by throwing to OBJ who out targeted Jefferson 48-43 in those last 8 games.

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

Not trying to crap on what your saying because it's true, but to me that looks like McVay scheming him open on that one.

Pretty sure that’s how it usually drawn up on any given (non go) route the past 50 years

 

[MachS]

Not really, because they clearly wanted to build chemistry by throwing to OBJ who out targeted Jefferson 48-43 in those last 8 games.

Thats fair, but if you look at snap count it was a huge advantage for Van. So why not more targets? Granted he's the better blocker and knows the offense so makes sense he hardly came off the field, but I just think we should've felt his impact more the latter half of the season and through the playoffs.

He did have a knee issue... hoping that was a big part of his problem.

I honestly forgot about his knee. Yea hopefully that was the culprit and something he played through which affected his play.

 

[PARAM]

You don't think Van should've had an obvious uptick in production after the OBJ signing while OBJ was learning the offense and building chemistry with Stafford? He had a few nice games but when you look at the film and stats down the stretch, our last 8 games including the 4 playoff games he was virtually invisible. And it's not like he didn't have the targets. 6 targets vs MIN, 5 vs BAL, 5 vs SF, and 8 vs CIN. His playoff run was especially bad and his inability to fight for balls lead to multiple turnovers for Stafford.

He was invisible because Kupp, OBJ and Higbee were the top 3 targets. By design I'm sure. In his second game OBJ played was targeted 10 times. The game plan was obviously Kupp and OBJ......and that was the right plan. What do you want VJ to do, turn into DJax?

What kind of production did you expect from VJ? Take Kupps targets?The first 4 games OBJ played he was targeted 25 times, VJ 24. VJ caught 14 for 246 and 3 TDs, OBJ caught 15 for 204 and 3 TDs. WTF?

As soon as Deeshawn opted out, VJ became the deep threat. If I'm to believe the "get Toney" crowd, VJ was a problem down the stretch.....you know that stretch that saw the Rams win 9 of their last 10. Wow, if only VJ could play we might have won 10 and the Superbowl. Geesh. It certainly is that lull of the off season where reason takes a backseat.

 

[MarkyMark]

Jefferson, Rapp, Atwell & a 2023 6'th for Toney.

Jefferson's gonna be a stud.....they better not even think about trading him in the near future!! I like that kid a lot.

 

[Riverumbbq]

Jefferson's gonna be a stud.....they better not even think about trading him in the near future!! I like that kid a lot.

I doubt he's going anywhere this year, but good luck beyond that ...

 

[dieterbrock]

I doubt he's going anywhere this year, but good luck beyond that ...

He's got one more year after this year, so I dont see him going anywhere since he's dirt cheap. He keeps the 800+ yards and 6+ TD's as a 3rd WR, he'll be getting 3rd round comp pick kind of money

 

[PARAM]

His playoff run was especially bad and his inability to fight for balls lead to multiple turnovers for Stafford.

That's a crock of BS. Stafford had 11 picks during our 9-1 run to finish the season and win the SB. VJ was the target on 2 of those picks (Minnesota game; SB). And the latter must be what left a sour taste in your mouth. So much so, you exaggerate. Hell, "fight for the ball"? That pick in the Minnesota game was underthrown by almost 5 yards with VJ running full speed. The one in the SB he should have fought for, at least to knock it down. But that's just 2 of those 11 picks. You want to know who was targeted in the other 9? Kupp twice. OBJ twice. Higbee twice. Skowronek twice. And Michel. So what's the reason for the exaggeration that "his inability to fight for balls lead to multiple turnovers for Stafford"? Because your argument losses a lot of steam when you are so inaccurate. He was the target on 2 picks and had the chance to fight for the ball on one of them. That's "multiple"?

 

[Riverumbbq]

He's got one more year after this year, so I dont see him going anywhere since he's dirt cheap. He keeps the 800+ yards and 6+ TD's as a 3rd WR, he'll be getting 3rd round comp pick kind of money

Or traded next season if one of Atwell, Harris, Skowronek or a potential draft pick/UDFA from this next week steps up.

 

[PARAM]

You should never be against upgrading talent on your roster as long as it doesn't affect the overall culture or locker room stability of a team. To me the only argument that can be made against Toney is his maturity and fit culture wise, there shouldn't be an argument for not trading Jefferson if it lands us a more talented receiver.

And I'm not. I would be all in on any trade that upgraded our roster. That's how you keep winning. But here's the rub. Toney's immaturity is the reason I don't like this idea. It's all unnecessary now as he's reported to OTA's, which is probably why the Giants let it out they were fielding offers for him. Light a fire under his ass. Obviously, something that has to be done with such a talented, self-centered, diva receiver.

 

[SuperMan28]

All for the right price.