Ray Lewis

[Thordaddy]

Let me begin with this,I am NO Ray Lewis fan, he concealed details of a double homocide and IMO unless he personally was an accomplice he didn't have the right to,if he was then he's a murderer.
Anyway , he's out for the season and the talking heads ( most of whom I hold in low esteem) are speculating IF this is the end for him.
Regardless what else I think of him Lewis is not the sort to go out with his tail between his legs, he will rehab the injury and attempt a comeback IMO, his ego won't let him do anything else.

 

[Angry Ram]

I'm not either.

Steeler fan.

BUT...he'll be back. For sure.

 

[libertadrocks]

Im a big fan of his(On the field and in the locker room). I leave the off the field stuff out of it. He isnt the linebacker he used to be, but the way he leads that physically defense emotionally is inspiring. His pre-game speeches are poetic in the most agressive way possible. After listening to him you wanna go rip someones head off, even if youre just chillin on your couch.

I would hate to see him go out like this. I dont think he'll let himself go out like this.

 

[Faceplant]

Im a big fan of his(On the field and in the locker room). I leave the off the field stuff out of it. He isnt the linebacker he used to be, but the way he leads that physically defense emotionally is inspiring. His pre-game speeches are poetic in the most agressive way possible. After listening to him you wanna go rip someones head off, even if youre just chillin on your couch.

I would hate to see him go out like this. I dont think he'll let himself go out like this.

This^^. Ray Lewis is not a murderer, that much I am sure of. If you haven't seen the Ray Lewis episode of the series "A Football Life", you really should. The guy is one of the greatest defensive players I have ever seen...at any position, and has been for a looong damn time in this league. He has also been nothing short of a model, stalwart contributer to and ambassador for the local community. He is more popular than Cal Ripken around here nowadays, and that is not an exaggeration. I believe he will be back doing damage again next year. That team has a nother 2-3 year window at least to win it all with all the talent they have. He will want to be a part of it.

 

[Thordaddy]

Im a big fan of his(On the field and in the locker room). I leave the off the field stuff out of it. He isnt the linebacker he used to be, but the way he leads that physically defense emotionally is inspiring. His pre-game speeches are poetic in the most agressive way possible. After listening to him you wanna go rip someones head off, even if youre just chillin on your couch.

I would hate to see him go out like this. I dont think he'll let himself go out like this.

This^^. Ray Lewis is not a murderer, that much I am sure of. If you haven't seen the Ray Lewis episode of the series "A Football Life", you really should. The guy is one of the greatest defensive players I have ever seen...at any position, and has been for a looong damn time in this league. He has also been nothing short of a model, stalwart contributer to and ambassador for the local community. He is more popular than Cal Ripken around here nowadays, and that is not an exaggeration. I believe he will be back doing damage again next year. That team has a nother 2-3 year window at least to win it all with all the talent they have. He will want to be a part of it.

THEN HE OWES the prosecution of the true murderers his co-operation.
We HAVE THE RIGHT to protect ourselves from prosecution by not giving self incriminating testimony, WE DO NOT have the right to withold information about the crimes of others to honor some code of silence ,the "I'm not a snitch" code is antethetical to the self incrimination concept.
We as citizens OWE the rest to testify when we aren't incriminating ourselves, Lewis refused, the familes of those murdered boys deserved that his testimony be heard,the HONOR among theives ethos DICTATES that IF he decides to "honor" that code ,he be called as one.
He is every thing anyone wants to portray him as when it comes to football, but as a person he is the slime ball I accuse him of being. TWO young men are DEAD, he knows what happened and won't come clean, F HIM, there are issues FAR BIGGER than football and I refuse to ignore the bigger issue to cow tow to the hero worship adulation ,godding up of athletes and sports figures that is CENTRAL to why Jerry Sandusky got away with what he did for so many years.
Sorry for the rant , but we are a society/world hell bent on cults of personality and I don't buy in, I have no autographs and marvel over the whole thing, I wish EVERY person had the self concept that NONE was greater nor held to a higher standard than they,it'd be a better world IMO, be your own hero is my idea.
I don't buy the sanitizing of his image, just don't.
He's got an incredible competitive drive, and IMO will turn that to a recovery and IMO if he retires it will be during the pre-season next year or after next years , but NO not like a lamb ,he'll go out like a lion if at all possible

 

[Sum1]

I for one get sick listening to Ray Lewis speak. I'm as big a football fan as I've ever met, but football doesn't change lives and it doesn't make men great. Ray Lewis acts as though being the best defensive player in the league means you are a great human being.

 

[Faceplant]

Looks like we have differing opinions of Ray. I live in MD and have seen quite a bit of him over the years. Can he be over the top at times? Absolutely. Honestly, his intro dance makes me cringe and irritates the hell out of me. That aside, I have never seen him act like he is better than anyone else, he is just a passionate player and man in general. I have read and heard more stories than I can count of him giving back to the community....as in going WELL above and beyond what is asked of him.

The 2 men that were killed that night may very well have instigated that altercation. I am not saying they deserved to die for it, but lets not act like these were two choir boys that just happened to be attacked whilst strolling past the Gold Club. As far as the trial is concerned, he DID testify against his boys.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/ ... se.03.html

 

[Thordaddy]

I for one get sick listening to Ray Lewis speak. I'm as big a football fan as I've ever met, but football doesn't change lives and it doesn't make men great. Ray Lewis acts as though being the best defensive player in the league means you are a great human being.

Pretty well the way I see it, Marshal Faulk was pretty well the same guy as Janoris Jenkins when it came to being a family man,my daughter worked for the Chevy's Marshal frequented while he played in St.L and he regularly brought two women at a time to the restaurant and it was clear he was intending threesomes and wanted the world to know it.

I love football and the performances and effort, but like you say, the man vs. the player is a line of distinction that the press continuously blurs and "gods " athletes up in nauseating fashion.

WATERS: Lewis said, after the fight was over, defendant Sweeting told him, he'd thrown punches with a knife in his hand. Murder charges against Lewis were dropped after he pleaded guilty to one misdemeanor count of obstructing of justice
I love Charles Barkley's position on it ,he has the right perspective IMO.

But ya know I know mine isn't avery popular opinion and I don't intend to belabor it ,so IMA step down off the soap box cuz I hear the banjos and I also need to go floss my tooth, :tooth:

 

[Yamahopper]

I just look at players on the field. Don't really care what they do off the clock.

He's been a really great player for a number of years but has slowed the last couple.
The Ravens are done with him, they will move Upshaw inside and just move on, If he gets a job next year in the NFL it will be as a Jet.
He had his day.

 

[Faceplant]

I just look at players on the field. Don't really care what they do off the clock.

He's been a really great player for a number of years but has slowed the last couple.
The Ravens are done with him, they will move Upshaw inside and just move on, If he gets a job next year in the NFL it will be as a Jet.
He had his day.

No offense...but I couldn't agree less. If he is able to return at 90% of what he was THIS season....he is still a top 10 MLB in this league. He will not play for another team. JMO....

 

[Stranger]

Pretty well the way I see it, Marshal Faulk was pretty well the same guy as Janoris Jenkins when it came to being a family man,my daughter worked for the Chevy's Marshal frequented while he played in St.L and he regularly brought two women at a time to the restaurant and it was clear he was intending threesomes and wanted the world to know it.

Wait, what?

Marshall Faulk, the high paid HOF football players, used to take his dates to Chevy's Restaurant? Are you kidding me?

As far as Ray is concerned, the NFL & Raven's PR machines have done a fantastic job of wiping over any possible memory of his actions on that night. Once Art Modell stepped up to the plate to back Ray, I think it became quite evident we'd ever have a real clue what really happened.

P.S. I'm just reading Ray's Court transcript linked to above, and wow, talk about leading the witness. All Ray really has to say is "correct", as the lawyers are the ones doing all the picture painting of the events. I just found it kind of bizzare that in this testimony it isn't Ray who is providing the storyline, it is the lawyers.

Furthermore, CNN cut out their coverage at what appears to be a crucial moment in Ray's testimony, which was quite odd at best. The laywer & Ray were just about to get into how the prosecution coerced Ray's initial testimony. I hadn't heard this before until reading this transcript. Would love to get my hands on the actual court transcript, so I can read the rest of Ray's testimony.

 

[Thordaddy]

I just look at players on the field. Don't really care what they do off the clock.He's been a really great player for a number of years but has slowed the last couple.
The Ravens are done with him, they will move Upshaw inside and just move on, If he gets a job next year in the NFL it will be as a Jet.
He had his day.

In the end neither do I hopper, but when they start godding them up ,I throw the flag.
I mean would you have Mike Vick groom your dog?

Yeah INT. Chevys Crestwood was a player hang out during the GSOT and what I was referring to was that Marshal had several out of wedlock children , had a domestic violence charge made against him but sort of in minor case OJ SImpson model the St. Louis press godded him up.

His private life IS his business but the NFL PR machine creating shrines to people you wouldn't want as neighbors makes me puke.

Adulation is IMO unwarrented, you can love the game and admire the way a player plays without globalizing and seeing them as what their agents package them as .

 

[libertadrocks]

What happened to innocent until proven guilty?

Ultimately no one here knows what happened that night so judging him on what you think may have happened is unfair.

The prosecution wouldn't have agreed to a plee deal with Lewis if they had a solid case. The fact that the other 2 suspects were acquitted proves the case was porous at best. They had a chance to make an example out of him and didnt.

 

[Yamahopper]

I just look at players on the field. Don't really care what they do off the clock.He's been a really great player for a number of years but has slowed the last couple.
The Ravens are done with him, they will move Upshaw inside and just move on, If he gets a job next year in the NFL it will be as a Jet.
He had his day.

In the end neither do I hopper, but when they start godding them up ,I throw the flag.
I mean would you have Mike Vick groom your dog?

Yeah INT. Chevys Crestwood was a player hang out during the GSOT and what I was referring to was that Marshal had several out of wedlock children , had a domestic violence charge made against him but sort of in minor case OJ SImpson model the St. Louis press godded him up.

His private life IS his business but the NFL PR machine creating shrines to people you wouldn't want as neighbors makes me puke.

Adulation is IMO unwarrented, you can love the game and admire the way a player plays without globalizing and seeing them as what their agents package them as .

These cats today are no worse than the players back in the day. Screw ups gets more publicity now than they did 30 years ago and that tilts public opinion. And your right that NFL propaganda machine builds these players up to a little more than they are at times.

I attach no sentiment to players, they are basically pieces of meat that are interchangeable. When I go to a game I want to see good hard nosed winning football and what they can do off the field is up to team and league rules and law enforcement. Just like anyone else because in the end the're just people like the rest of us.
A few bad apples really ruin it for the rest of the players. Most players do great things in the community and donate their time and money to make the cities they play in a better place. The Rams have always had players that reach out and help. I think that's great!!! But he still has to make plays on Sunday.

As far as Faulk.....Good work if you can get it. :sly:
Vick might become a dog groomer next year. He's going to be one of those guys that go from starter to out of the league in one year if he keeps playing at this level.

P.S. Some might think my sentiment on players is a bit harsh....If I went to the ticket office and said " Hey, I've bought tickets to every Ram game since they have been in STL. and before that LA, but I'm having a bad year so could you let me slide this season and I'll make it up to you next year" How far you think that would get me. Be watching at home. It's a bushiness and that's all it is.

 

[Thordaddy]

What happened to innocent until proven guilty?

Ultimately no one here knows what happened that night so judging him on what you think may have happened is unfair.

The prosecution wouldn't have agreed to a plee deal with Lewis if they had a solid case. The fact that the other 2 suspects were acquitted proves the case was porous at best. They had a chance to make an example out of him and didnt.

We know he transported the perps from the scene in his limo, and that he KNEW police would want to know what happened but attempted to conceal the facts from the beginning.
I'd say the prosecutions ineptness was palpable and BTW I'm not advocating jail time, he beat the rap, but INOCENCE was not proven it was assumed / presumed MAJOR difference.

The presumption of innocence extends to the courtroom door, not to opinion and the inability to prove a case doesn't establish innocence,it just means that you can't get a verdict.
Al Capone was never convicted of anything beyond tax evasion ,INOCENT? I doubt it, OJ innocent? not according to the preponderance of evidence presented in the civil trial.

Our legal system puts extreme burdens upon the prosecution IN ORDER to protect innocent people ,IN THE FULL KNOWLEDGE that some guilty parties will walk because the burden is so....burdensome.

Bottom line regardless the provable facts, Lewis was hanging with thugs, knew they were, everything that happened that night was predictable and has played out enough times that anyone present when it goes down has good cause to know better than be there.after the shizzle went down he helped fleeing perps,that doesn't pass my smell test,and in the end MY SMELL TEST is ALL I'm discussing,and whether I buy the PR machine that has diligently tried to craft my opinion, I don't.

Then again my major point here was not this though it WAS and IS , Ray Lewis is a warrior, he won't let an injury get him down, he'll rehab his injury and walk away from the game on his own terms,I am as equally certain of that as that he isn't the admirable guy the league team and his agent want us to think he is. He's a tough SOB, but an SOB none the less.

His play has deteriorated, he's playing as much on bluff now as ability, he's done but the Ravens will try to keep their HOF LB until he decides to go.

BTW hopper, I can't agree that today's bad boys aren't any worse than the bad boys of the past, the drug culture, thug life, gangstah influence has made today's "bad boys" significantly more sketchy.Pac Man, Plax, Ray Ray, faceit it's a different culture now, those old time guys were tame in comparison,not that they were any more admirable ,but they didn't engage in gun play the way a lot of these guys do, again I blame the drug culture and the alarming number of young men who've been in and out of prison enough so the culture of prison has become emulated in pop culture.

 

[Sum1]

What happened to innocent until proven guilty? That is in a court of law. People make their own judgements.

Ultimately no one here knows what happened that night so judging him on what you think may have happened is unfair.

The prosecution wouldn't have agreed to a plee deal with Lewis if they had a solid case. The fact that the other 2 suspects were acquitted proves the case was porous at best. They had a chance to make an example out of him and didnt.